PowerSwitch Main Page
PowerSwitch
The UK's Peak Oil Discussion Forum & Community
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Companies going bankrupt/into administration
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... , 29, 30, 31  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> News
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
raspberry-blower



Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 1452

PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Potemkin Villager wrote:
clv101 wrote:
emordnilap wrote:
Toys"R"Us filing for bankruptcy in the States, over $5 billion in debt.


That's pretty impressive for a company whose business strategy involves buying bits of Chinese plastic for pennies, sticking it in a shiny box and selling it from warehouses for dollars. How do you screw that up to the tune of $5bn?


It takes a particular type of managerial talent that is all too common.


It's called asset stripping - load a company up with debt then get your hands on the best bits when it invariably goes belly up.
_________________
A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools - Douglas Adams.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 13968
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To deflect that criticism (of what is all too common a strategy), they're blaming it on on-line competition of course.
_________________
"Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren’t lesser beings, they’re just like us. So I say fụck the Buddhists" - Bjork
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 13968
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and here's Charles Hugh Smith talking about it.

Quote:
if a CEO refuses to load a company up with debt, a private-equity financier with access to cheap Federal Reserve credit will scoop up the company in a private buyout, fire the management, extract immense profits by loading the company with debt, then take the hollowed-out shell public again, reaping another windfall of financialized gains.

Note that the private-equity financiers have every incentive to lay off employees, especially experienced workers who earn higher salaries, to reduce costs before they take the hollowed-out shell public.


He makes the point that governments, corporations and individuals now rely substantially upon debt as a normal modus operandum.
_________________
"Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren’t lesser beings, they’re just like us. So I say fụck the Buddhists" - Bjork
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
raspberry-blower



Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 1452

PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another airline in trouble: Monarch Airline on the brink as licence in doubt

Quote:
Considering the current status of the company’s finances it is unclear if a temporary licence renewal from the CAA would prevent the company from going into administration, raising significant questions for the more than six million passengers expected to fly this year from airports including the company’s base in Luton, London Gatwick, Birmingham, Leeds, and Manchester

_________________
A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools - Douglas Adams.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 776
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raspberry-blower wrote:
Another airline in trouble: Monarch Airline on the brink as licence in doubt

Quote:
Considering the current status of the company’s finances it is unclear if a temporary licence renewal from the CAA would prevent the company from going into administration, raising significant questions for the more than six million passengers expected to fly this year from airports including the company’s base in Luton, London Gatwick, Birmingham, Leeds, and Manchester


I wonder if the apparently uberprofitable Ryanair may be in the same ball park? Declaring anxious sounding plans for ultra expansion and ever increasing declared numbers followed by an embarrassing forced retreat is a sure Enron like marker for dark skies ahead.
_________________
"Test to destruction: engineers like to do that. Only with a test to destruction can you find the outer limits of a system's strength".Kim Stanley Robinson
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9810
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Ryanair is just short of pilots, as they claim, Monarch going bust could give them the injection of staff that they want. It might save scumbag, Michael O'Leary, having to pay his pilots more money as well. He'll be pleased about that being a low cost, high profit airline and all!
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 776
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes Ken but can all the "low cost" carriers be profitable at the same time?

The personal self interest capitalist system itself is a bit like a packet switch telecoms system with a brickwall finite capacity or an interconnected grid with a cascade shutdown finite capacity.

Once the system overloads and is driven on further into the entropy zone by desperate interested parties to try and maintain growth bau by "any means" the collapse pattern becomes even more unpredictable and potentially more terminal.

But I think many here have worked this out already.

Ah well back to a bit more Lonnie Johnson on Spotify for me.
_________________
"Test to destruction: engineers like to do that. Only with a test to destruction can you find the outer limits of a system's strength".Kim Stanley Robinson
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9810
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is all showing that the "free market" bit of the current economic fad is not tenable and will eventually lead to the dominance of "The One" which will rule over us all! We have already passed the end of the free market capitalist system and are well into corporatist system but this is being disguised as a capitalist system because it involves socialism for the corporations. Now they have their safety net in place the corporations can carry on getting bigger by swallowing up their competition safe in the knowledge that if they do make a cockup, as Lloyds did in taking over HBOS, they will be baled out by the taxpayer.

Eventually there will be "The One" in each sector and some time after that just "The One" globally. Long before that happens the human race will be just a bunch of slaves to a few psychopaths running the system.

Luckily for us the economic system or the ecological system will collapse and eventually take a few of us back to somewhere near the stone age.

If we can exchange the free market bit for a regulated system we might carry on with some level of prosperity for a bit longer. Prosperity is relative and in this case it is relative to the stone age!
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
adam2
Site Admin


Joined: 02 Jul 2007
Posts: 6206
Location: North Somerset

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Monarch have now ceased trading, as forecast.
_________________
"Installers and owners of emergency diesels must assume that they will have to run for a week or more"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
johnhemming2



Joined: 30 Jun 2015
Posts: 1963

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenneal - lagger wrote:
This is all showing that the "free market" bit of the current economic fad is not tenable

It shows unsustainable private sector businesses come to an end whilst those run by the state get more and more central funding or increase their prices.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9810
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnhemming2 wrote:
kenneal - lagger wrote:
This is all showing that the "free market" bit of the current economic fad is not tenable

It shows unsustainable private sector businesses come to an end whilst those run by the state get more and more central funding or increase their prices.


RBS and Lloyds? The car makers in the USA?
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
raspberry-blower



Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 1452

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aren't the airlines subsidized with no VAT on aviation fuel?

Cheap airlines business models are only possible with loopholes and lax interpretations of the rules. Even then it is not always a viable concern.

By the way the website that anyone affected by this collapse is this:
https://monarch.caa.co.uk/
_________________
A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools - Douglas Adams.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9810
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raspberry-blower wrote:
Aren't the airlines subsidized with no VAT on aviation fuel?...


The Bretton Woods Agreement of 1944 ensured that there would be no taxation of any kind for aircraft fuel at the insistence of the USA. So airlines are subsidised compared to trains and buses which pay tax on their fuel.

(Edited one time - Ken Neal)
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians


Last edited by kenneal - lagger on Tue Oct 03, 2017 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 13968
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenneal - lagger wrote:
raspberry-blower wrote:
Aren't the airlines subsidized with no VAT on aviation fuel?...


The Bretton Woods Agreement of 1944 ensured that there would be no taxation of any the insistence of the USA. So airlines are subsidised compared to trains and buses which pay tax on their fuel.


And, of course, who pays for the infrastructure, the additional roads required to service the airports, the cost of pollution, the cost of education for the people involved, the emergency services etc etc.

To that extent you could argue that much of the corporate world is subsidised - but for untalked-about reasons the airline industry is a Very Special Case.

Oh, and no VAT.
_________________
"Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren’t lesser beings, they’re just like us. So I say fụck the Buddhists" - Bjork
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9810
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

emordnilap wrote:
...And, of course, who pays for the infrastructure, the additional roads required to service the airports, the cost of pollution, the cost of education for the people involved, the emergency services etc etc.

To that extent you could argue that much of the corporate world is subsidised - but for untalked-about reasons the airline industry is a Very Special Case.

Oh, and no VAT.


That goes for the Road Transport industry as well although they do pay a little in Road Fund License (or whatever it's called these days).

The whole economic system is skewed by the ability of polluters to dump their exhaust into the atmosphere completely free of charge. You can't dump into waterways or the land (unless it's artificial fertilisers or agrichemicals) free of charge, at least in the UK and Europe, but the air that we all breath is different for some reason.
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> News All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... , 29, 30, 31  Next
Page 30 of 31

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group