PowerSwitch Main Page
PowerSwitch
The UK's Peak Oil Discussion Forum & Community
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Westminster Terror Attack
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> News
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
raspberry-blower



Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 1453

PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:39 pm    Post subject: Westminster Terror Attack Reply with quote

At least 4 dead including the assailant

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-39355505
_________________
A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools - Douglas Adams.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4282
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curious that the attacker chose perhaps the only place in the UK as well (or perhaps better)armed as the USA. At least he is gone so you don't have to prosecute and then incarcerate him for life.
If attacks of this type become common there will come a realization that the death toll in relation to the population is minuscule and the real cost is in the government response to something they can do little or nothing about.
When it becomes routine it will become worthless and will stop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PS_RalphW



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 5267
Location: Cambridge

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a copycat attack after the more bloody attacks in Europe. It is only the second fatal attack in a decade, and the last was a single murder. We have more deadly road accidents, and it is only intent that makes this terrorism, apart from the stabbing of the policeman
The attacker had no intention of surviving to be jailed, unlike previous attacks in this country.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
johnhemming2



Joined: 30 Jun 2015
Posts: 1976

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PS_RalphW wrote:
The attacker had no intention of surviving to be jailed, unlike previous attacks in this country.

These varied of course. Most intended to survive a small number didn't.

The attack with Mortars on No 10 in 1991 was potentially more bloody, save that the the IRA learnt (particularly after the Pub Bombings although they still did the attack in Warrington and others) that killing innocent bystanders turns everyone against you even those who might otherwise be sympathetic. Daesh and their sympathisers still have not learnt this.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 5667
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes they have. They don't care. They want their audience here (of majority whites) to get sufficiently pissed off as to make life difficult for and so push large portions of the indigenous muslim population to insurrection (and lets be honest, they never took much pushing in any event). And as for their own audience in the middle East, they will likely lap it up.

They want a holy war.

And they are going to get it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger
careful_eugene



Joined: 26 Jun 2006
Posts: 443
Location: Nottingham UK

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnhemming2 wrote:
killing innocent bystanders turns everyone against you even those who might otherwise be sympathetic. Daesh and their sympathisers still have not learnt this.

I think they have learnt this and they actively pursue this policy, they want to drive a wedge between muslims and everyone else in this country. TBH they are having a lot of success.
_________________
Never mind, it's all anarchy isn't it?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 13974
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are the true origins and motivations of the instigator even known yet? ("he is thought to have acted alone but was inspired by international terrorism according to The Guardian).
_________________
"Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren’t lesser beings, they’re just like us. So I say fụck the Buddhists" - Bjork
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 9822
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to the last BBC Radio news that I heard he was known to the police as he had cropped up on "the periphery" of another terrorist investigation but was not thought to be sufficiently dangerous to warrant further surveillance. How much we want to spend on these toe rags will govern how many attacks we suffer. We haven't done too badly so far although the hurt done in this attack is significant to those involved. The fact that the people involved had more chance of being mown down in an ordinary traffic accident is of no concern to them.
_________________
"When the last tree is cut down, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, Only then will you find out that you cannot eat money". --The Cree Indians
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 13974
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently, your man is "British born", not that that means that much.
_________________
"Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren’t lesser beings, they’re just like us. So I say fụck the Buddhists" - Bjork
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cubes



Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 565
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't believe that this was 'organised' by more than the man himself tbh. From what I understand firearms aren't that difficult to get in the UK if you know who to ask. I doubt anything short of a totalitarian state could have stopped this and even then I doubt it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jonny2mad



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 2422
Location: weston super mare

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you have 55,000 downloads of the inspire jihadi magazine to UK IP addresses in 3 months that mag is just for one jihadi group. we have 3000 people on jihadi john watch lists in the uk.

magazines like the one I mentioned tell you how to do attacks and make bombs. as the demographics change you will just see more and more of this the only solution would be the Charles the hammer martel or Vlad the impaler solution.

with people like Theresa may saying Islamist not Islamic you are not going to see that. I think a good section of the public get it or are starting to that's why they liked trump saying islamic

Enoch Powell said that people in power agree with him in private, but they were letting it end in a civil war because they were too cowardly to act, he knew where things were heading
_________________
"What causes more suffering in the world than the stupidity of the compassionate?"Friedrich Nietzsche

optimism is cowardice oswald spengler
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
johnhemming2



Joined: 30 Jun 2015
Posts: 1976

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me the enemy is the extremists who wish to create a global religious conflict. There are people who would like to broaden the enemy so that there is a global religious conflict. I think they are wrong.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 5667
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I have already argued many times, all organised religions are systems of law based upon the myth of a sky fairy and monotheistic religions are the worst of these in that they tend to be the most violent in their promotion of a singular vision.

The Old-Testament monotheism of the Bible was all blood and guts, to be sure. But, the New-Testament was largely the reverse of that. This latter divergence of tone in the Bible was further consolidated with the Reformation and Enlightenment which sought and largely succeeded in taming the more excessive aspects of the Western Christian theological tradition.

In Islam, on the other hand, the very reverse is the case, The tolerant version of the Quran is mostly the earlier passages. The latter part of the Quran, though, is the blood and guts part. Furthermore, Islam has not undergone a Reformation or Enlightenment. This means that the Quran is still regarded by many, if not the majority, of the followers of Islam to be the very Word Of God and that this word provides a literal instruction manual for living. This puts it and its followers in direct opposition to modern secular Western civilization.

Now, obviously, many Muslims do not follow the Quran in their daily lives in much the same way as many so-called Christians do not follow the Bible in their daily lives. But, because of the absolute requirement of a literal reading of the Quran, many Muslims will feel in their hearts that this means that they are not very good Muslims. Christianity, on the other hand, due to the reformation and Enlightenment I mentioned, has been tamed and reinterpreted for so long that, for Christians, this kind of guilt is more or less absent. Though, we do still have pockets of lunatic fringe elements even in the Christian tradition. They are just simply far fewer in number. That's all. This is one of the main reasons why, in my opinion, we do not see a majority of ordinary Muslims loudly condemning the kinds of acts witnessed the other day in London. Though, I am a little heartened to see the march of several thousand Muslims the other day. But, even then, as I read some of the placards on that march, it struck me that they are in a terrible bind in that they both wanted to be seen to condemn the actions of this man, but at the same time were trying to promote the Quran, on those placards in such a way as to not acknowledge any aspect of it as being responsible for his actions.

Thus, it is extremely easy to mount a Christian theological argument, for example, for why the actions of the IRA in the 70s, despite their protestations to the contrary, were the very antithesis of what it is to be a good Christian. On the other hand, it is very difficult to use the Quran to mount a similar argument against the kind of people committing the heinous acts of yesterday.

Indeed, the Quran can be used to quite easily argue that these people are simply following the Quranic scriptures to the letter. In other words, they are simply being "good" Muslims.

Quran (9:5) - "....So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush...."


Of course, the old testament contains many such bloodthirsty exhortations. But, as merely notional/cultural Christians, we can dismiss them as being of their time. With the Quran, this is not possible since such passages are viewed as being, quite literally, the WORD OF GOD.

In short, convert to Islam or die. That is the central, violent and, crucially, contemporary message of the Quran.


Last edited by Little John on Sat Mar 25, 2017 3:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Yahoo Messenger
jonny2mad



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 2422
Location: weston super mare

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 1:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnhemming2 wrote:
To me the enemy is the extremists who wish to create a global religious conflict. There are people who would like to broaden the enemy so that there is a global religious conflict. I think they are wrong.


I spent more than a decade debating Muslims and there is a global religious conflict the problem is non muslims are too dumb not to know it. personally, I think of pretty much all of our leaders are on a level with neville chamberlain at best.

Geert wilders gets it, trump to a degree, if someone uses the word Islamist they don't get it.

My late father knew more about Islam than anyone you would meet his advice was flee Europe, and that if he could go back in time he wouldn't have volunteered to fight at 14 in ww2. the war was a complete waste of time. what was the sense in losing millions of lives liberating France from the nazis to hand it over in a generation to jihadis .

if he was running things he would have done what Enoch Powell would have done he would do it now, but he had balls which not one person in politics today has.

if a marriage ain't working and isn't going to work you have a divorce you don't invite more of the brides family to live with you

if people are going to keep living in Europe my advice get ready for a bloody civil wars or series of them on the scale of world war two or larger that may run for hundreds of years.

All this caused by moral cowards
_________________
"What causes more suffering in the world than the stupidity of the compassionate?"Friedrich Nietzsche

optimism is cowardice oswald spengler
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
fuzzy



Joined: 29 Nov 2013
Posts: 595
Location: The Marches, UK

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't predict the end, but I can see problems. I think the history of India after independence is interesting to study. The truth is that Islam is an unworkable system. Everyone should hear the Koran in English. First to go are those who give up, next the athesists, then the other religions. There is nothing in the Old testament equivalent. That says you should kill people who trick you to conversion, not 'you should kill athesists'. Virtually all muslims worldwide are just 'in the club' like most religious masses. They pick what suits them, do what their parents did, or enjoy the community vibe and milking their status in Europe. The resurgent conversion of areas/warfare is funded by ME players rich on oil with no allotments to tend. This stretches to Chechnya, the 'Stans, Yugoslavia, Leicester, Bradford, Brum, Oldham, East Asia etc. As long as our govs are grovelling to ME oil money, nothing will be concluded.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> News All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Page 1 of 7

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group