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Identity Politics, Class Warfare and Labour's future
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 11155
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Little John wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote:
Little John wrote:
People like you.


Oh, give it a break Steve. I am not your enemy. I'm continually attacked by the very people you think I am one of. You've never really understood where I am coming from, and routinely misunderstand my posts, usually because you've jumped to incorrect conclusions.
I understand exactly where you "are coming from"


You really don't.
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kenneal - lagger
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Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 12352
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam, can you set up a People's Party of Palestine v's the Palestinian People's Party thread and put the LJ v's UE posts on it please? Wink Wink Wink

I know that LJ and UE can see a difference, perhaps UE less so, but the rest of us find it rather tiring, to say the least. It is getting very Pythonesque!


I was given the Eddy Jones autobiography for Christmas and I've just read his bit on the Australian art of "sledging" and the above should be taken in that vein but rather than putting people off their stroke it's about keeping them on the subject.
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careful_eugene



Joined: 26 Jun 2006
Posts: 600
Location: Nottingham UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

emordnilap wrote:
I, Daniel Blake underplays the horrors of the UK welfare system.

I understand that the government has gradually introduced a system that is designed to inflict misery and hardship on anyone who finds themselves in the unfortunate position of being poor, they are Tories after all. What I don't understand is why are some of the people who work for the DWP such c**ts?
https://www.katebelgrave.com/2018/05/behind-the-scenes-with-frontline-service-users-in-austerity-excerpts-from-interviews-and-covert-videos-and-recordings/
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kenneal - lagger
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Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 12352
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

careful_eugene wrote:
............ What I don't understand is why are some of the people who work for the DWP such c**ts?.....


They've been trained that way to save the Exchequer money and their promotion and pension depend on being good employees. If the training and work ethos changed so would they, rapidly.
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 8530
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenneal - lagger wrote:
careful_eugene wrote:
............ What I don't understand is why are some of the people who work for the DWP such c**ts?.....


They've been trained that way to save the Exchequer money and their promotion and pension depend on being good employees. If the training and work ethos changed so would they, rapidly.
yes
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Lord Beria3



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 5064
Location: Moscow Russia

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its the housing benefits that cause problems.

Single mums on benefit have kids and are able to get a bigger council home- which would cost a fortune in the private sector.

Happens quite a bit where I live. People get so pissed off about it when the private rentals or cost of buying a home is high and some lazy bugger sits on their ass all day in a big council estate with 5 kids.

My missus knows a ex single mum (now happily married) who got so much benefits under Labour that she didn't need to work and had lots of money to spend on make-up, clothes and so on. After the Tories got in her benefits package shrunk and she had to get a job which she still is in.

Good on the Tories. A lovely girl but had it too easy under Labour.

Re Labour - Nandy I think could prove a winner. So tempted to put a £10 on betfair exchange...
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 11155
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Beria3 wrote:

Re Labour - Nandy I think could prove a winner. So tempted to put a £10 on betfair exchange...


I am sure she'll be a good leader if she wins. Whether she does or not may depend on how many second choice votes she gets. Her biggest obstacle may be getting past the first round of voting. Needs to beat Jess Phillips.
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Lord Beria3



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
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Location: Moscow Russia

PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://consent.yahoo.com/collectConsent?sessionId=3_cc-session_a8b355e0-ab82-4926-9e7e-eabbe16e3a01&lang=en-gb&inline=false

Have a read UE.

Placed a 10 quid wager on her today on betfair exchange.
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Lord Beria3



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What with rumours that Unite might back Nandy my little trade is already up £3 quid!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7885327/Could-union-shun-Rebecca-Long-Bailey-Unites-Len-McCluskey-said-impressed-Lisa-Nandy.html
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Lord Beria3



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
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Location: Moscow Russia

PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Breaking news... Nandy backed by NUM.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-leadership-lisa-nandy-union-wigan-mp-a9283786.html

Quote:
Labour leadership hopeful Lisa Nandy has won the support of the National Union of Mineworkers (NUM) as she battles to succeed Jeremy Corbyn.

In a boost to her campaign, the NUM said the Wigan MP was the candidate Labour needs to "regain trust with the voters we’ve lost" after its disastrous electoral defeat in December.

While the NUM has a small membership, its endorsement is highly symbolic and its decision to back Ms Nandy will come as a blow to Rebecca Long-Bailey, the left-wing favourite who is regarded as the heir apparent to Mr Corbyn.

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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 11155
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Beria3 wrote:
https://consent.yahoo.com/collectConsent?sessionId=3_cc-session_a8b355e0-ab82-4926-9e7e-eabbe16e3a01&lang=en-gb&inline=false

Have a read UE.

Placed a 10 quid wager on her today on betfair exchange.


That link doesn't go anywhere.
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 11155
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Beria3 wrote:
What with rumours that Unite might back Nandy my little trade is already up £3 quid!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7885327/Could-union-shun-Rebecca-Long-Bailey-Unites-Len-McCluskey-said-impressed-Lisa-Nandy.html


If McClusky backs Nandy then she may well come from behind to win this, yes. RLB is a shit candidate. People are looking at her and thinking "Really??".

EDIT: Also, there's a key moment in this campaign when there's three of them left in it. If it is clear that Starmer would beat RLB in the final two, then RLB supporters might switch to Nandy because they think (correctly) that Nandy has a better chance of beating Starmer.

I think this is already between Starmer and Nandy now. I think RLB is fading.
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Lord Beria3



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 5064
Location: Moscow Russia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree.

That failed link article basically says Nandy could win through second preference voting. Like what you are saying.

Her odds could definitely hit 50 per cent (currently in the early teens) so more profit to come.

I note that she came out in support of free movement. That might work well with the membership but implies that she doesn't get why labour lost.
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fuzzy



Joined: 29 Nov 2013
Posts: 1383
Location: The Marches, UK

PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if JW is having a dry month prebrexit, as his writing seems sharp this January:

https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2020/01/08/labour-leadership-contest-the-art-of-tinkering-with-the-funeral-arrangements/

If anyone doubts the invisible US and UK money problems - read this one:

https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2020/01/15/jp-morgan-insanity-brexit-incontinence-why-fake-v-genuine-news-is-a-red-herring/
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 8530
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fuzzy wrote:
I wonder if JW is having a dry month prebrexit, as his writing seems sharp this January:

https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2020/01/08/labour-leadership-contest-the-art-of-tinkering-with-the-funeral-arrangements/

If anyone doubts the invisible US and UK money problems - read this one:

https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2020/01/15/jp-morgan-insanity-brexit-incontinence-why-fake-v-genuine-news-is-a-red-herring/
I've never read anything by JW before. I will be from now on. Outstanding.
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