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Superb book about the big picture
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 11118
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 2:16 pm    Post subject: Superb book about the big picture Reply with quote

Edit by admin to remove link, a more ethical supplier is suggested a few posts down.

Wow! This is the book I have been looking for. Radically trans-disciplinary and correctly identifies that money as we understand it is the single most fundamental obstacle to creating a sustainable world. Not cheap, but brilliant.

Article by the same person: https://braveneweurope.com/alf-hornborg-a-globalised-solar-powered-future-is-wholly-unrealistic-and-our-economy-is-the-reason-why

And a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sORbItAvhco

All absolutely spot on, IMO.

More, on free trade and sustainability: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdhnsOv1zoE

And on the whole thing. This is brilliant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MB1r8r8z8v0&t=638s
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kenneal - lagger
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Joined: 20 Sep 2006
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Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam, can you print the name of the book please as I don't want to follow that URL onto that website. I will search for it elsewhere.
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adam2
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Location: North Somerset

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://blackwells.co.uk/bookshop/product/Nature-Society-and-Justice-in-the-Anthropocene-by-Alf-Hornborg-author/9781108429375

Non dodgy supplier.
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Snail



Joined: 14 Apr 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why is this priced so high, £85?

I might have paid something for it as it sounds interesting and is something i'd read, but not £85.


Last edited by Snail on Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:29 pm; edited 2 times in total
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kenneal - lagger
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Adam. That was the supplier that I was going to try. Could you edit "dodgy tax avoider" out of your first post please as plenty of people will just click on the first reference that they see.
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kenneal - lagger
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snail wrote:
Why is this priced so high, £85?

I've just downloaded it for free. I might have paid something for it as it sounds interesting and is something i'd read, but not £85.


It's seen as a low volume sale, academic, hardback book so attracts a high price to cover the publisher's costs.
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Snail



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Academic book prices are ridiculous. I used to just buy older editions for university and saved a fortune. Now i would just download them.

I know it must give the author a buzz having a book published and physically on the shelves, but...

---

I've just edited my posts in case the author is ue's friend or something, and people like me must annoy authors and publishers. Very Happy


Last edited by Snail on Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:33 pm; edited 3 times in total
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
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Location: south east England

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snail wrote:
Why is this priced so high, £85?


Typical of short-print-run academic books. It has to be that high in order to cover the costs.
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
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Location: south east England

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snail wrote:
Academic book prices are ridiculous. I used to just buy older editions for university and saved a fortune. Now i would just download them.

I know it must give the author a buzz having a book published and physically on the shelves, but...

---

I've just edited my posts in case the author is ue's friend on something.


Never heard of him until recently.

It is such a shame that so few people will read this book. The idea is truly revolutionary. Set up an anti-globalisation parallel currency engineered to create sustainability, and then just wait for the global currency system to implode.
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UndercoverElephant



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Location: south east England

PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I have posted this widely on the internet and absolutely nobody gets it. They do not understand why this suggestion is different to anything before. They don't understand why this system could change the way the world operates.

To recap:

It is a national parallel currency that is issued only by the government (NOT by banks as debt), is used to pay a UBI but can only be used to buy goods and services made within a certain radius of the buyer, and possibly also restricted to food and other essential products and services. This will have the effect of setting up a parallel economy designed to reverse globalisation. It will take power away from large companies, especially the multinationals, and massively stimulate new localised entrepreneurship.

It is not a local currency. It would not fail like local currencies do, because the government will be dishing out.
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clv101
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

UndercoverElephant wrote:
It is not a local currency. It would not fail like local currencies do, because the government will be dishing out.


I don't follow, 'because the government will be dishing out' is no guarantee against failure? Lots of government backed things are crap and fail.
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Catweazle



Joined: 17 Feb 2008
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Location: Little England, over the hills

PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Effectively it's putting a tax on imported goods, not sure that countries we are trying to negotiate trade deals with would be happy, they'd probably tax our exports to them.
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adam2
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Joined: 02 Jul 2007
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Location: North Somerset

PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

clv101 wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote:
It is not a local currency. It would not fail like local currencies do, because the government will be dishing out.


I don't follow, 'because the government will be dishing out' is no guarantee against failure? Lots of government backed things are crap and fail.
,

Apart from the general possibility or likelihood of anything government run failing, I see another problem.
If this new "funny money" is to be issued centrally but is only valid for locally produced goods/services, how is use to be restricted ?
Local to Penzance is rather different from local to Manchester.
And what about local, but still international ? From parts of the south coast, France is more "local" than is London.
In parts of Northern Ireland, the Irish republic is very local, just a short walk, but is also international.
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adam2
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Catweazle wrote:
Effectively it's putting a tax on imported goods, not sure that countries we are trying to negotiate trade deals with would be happy, they'd probably tax our exports to them.


This is true, but surely the idea is to reduce globalisation ? So if we tax imports, and other nations tax imports from us, then globalisation is discouraged, at least slightly.
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
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Location: south east England

PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

clv101 wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote:
It is not a local currency. It would not fail like local currencies do, because the government will be dishing out.


I don't follow, 'because the government will be dishing out' is no guarantee against failure? Lots of government backed things are crap and fail.


If people are given a new currency to spend, as a UBI, then they will spend it.
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